What's with the band name? Well, it appears to be a joke about Romeo and Juliet and how Romeo dug this other girl before Juliet came on the scene. And while the record title is certain to raise some eyebrows, the band are by no means fascists. It is instead a punishing record about human folly and is intended to make people think, something this outspoken and also very Christian band are very good at. Before There Was Rosalyn have come out the gate locked and loaded, prepared to open minds and hearts while sparking conversation.

Ok, I am going to inject a little aside here so that any readers unfamiliar with me can figure out the type of person they are dealing with here. I associate punk with bands like Rites Of Spring and Bad Religion, groups bent on tackling the outside world and showing its' flaws while creating and sharing a personal experience, the mark of true revolution. That's why the whole Christian punk and Christian metalcore movement has seemed weird to me in some ways at times. Granted, Bad Brains always praised God and they are hands down as punk as it gets, but some current newer groups seem really closed minded or conservative, which is less about bringing people together than enforcing stringent values. That to me seems the opposite of punk, no matter how much people like ex-Misfits second stringer Michael Graves and the poor saps at Conservativepunk.com blab about how punks are against big government and so should be conservative. Big government isn't by definition bad, just if it IS bad, much like every Republican isn't bad (just most of them)! But, there are a few other things you're overlooking that punk is also supposed to be about, guys! How about freedom of expression? Typically that isn't big on the far right's agenda (though the PMRC was run by Democrats, I shall certainly concede).

The Conservativepunk.com mission statement says they aim to..."stretch political minds by exposing other political ideas outside the usual bi-partisan arena and making (punks) think about what else may be out there." Lovely. Me too! For some reason, I trust Rolling Stone's political writer Matt Taibbi more, as he'll properly send up Obama for letting down voters when post-election he is too closely tied to Citigroup AND yet Taibbi will also never fail to overlook at the same time that the majority of right-wingers basically seem INSANE! You can't call yourselves "Conservative" when Bush ran up the deficit so high that we are now basically indentured servants to China (and too dumb to know it)! That doesn't conserve anything, especially our freedoms. Incidentally, I want to use some bailout money to make thousands of fortune cookies that say "Free Tibet". Who is with me on that one? While it is agonizing to see Obama dropping the ball in a lot of crucial areas like conceding so much to insurance companies within the new Health Insurance "Reform", he is still a thousand times better to have in office than Sarah Palin! Shit, she is single handedly making even liberals start to reconsider if letting women vote/into politics was a good idea (I'm joking)! Palin wasn't about to win the Nobel Peace Prize for promoting diplomacy, that's for sure!

Anyway, the “Golden Rule” from the Bible is actually great, an ideal and wonderful lesson, but to read The Old Testament it is hard to swallow some of the wrathful stuff wedged into the "good" book. Then again, here I am completely being rather wrathful myself at the moment. I guess to further illustrate, the ingenious author Terry Pratchet recently told UK publication The Guardian, "I'd rather be a rising ape than a fallen angel." He talked about how it is less fascinating to be made by a creator (who seems rather spiteful in the Old Testament) than to have overcome our chimp instinct to throw shit at trees and chatter long enough to have evolved as far as humans have! There's also the fact that, even at its earliest point, the Bible could have been written with the intent to control certain people. As hardcore legend turned rapper Freddy Madball recently rhymed on his new solo record Catholic Guilt, "Who'se book or plan should I follow if they're written by hands?" There will always be different interpretations of The Bible and many of them lead to some very negative stuff. I am a new-found fan of the late Ruth Hurmence Green’s “The God From Galilee,” one of 41 articles in the Disinformation anthology, Everything You Know About God Is Wrong: The Disinformation Guide To Religion. She wrote a very funny send up of ways that it could seem like Jesus is actually rather rude at times. (read it here.)

Christmas 2009 is around the corner as I write this. [Editor’s Note: But the ediatrix was slow in getting this posted. Ha.] This is the time of year when we look back on recent events, try to be close to loved ones and also hopefully find the time to reflect enough to think about how we can improve things next year. This matters whether you believe in Jesus, Santa or would rather worship James Cameron's Avatar. It is also a time for promoting understanding and (even argumentative) discussion, something punk should always be about. Whether we agree with one another or not, everyone has a right to their opinions, so a hearty Merry Christmas to Conservativepunk.com (you fucking retarded, curdled milk infested twats)!

That said and done with, it was very enjoyable to interview BTWR vocalist Carlos Salazar and to hear his compelling and deeply thought out responses to my questions about faith AND music. We didn't get into politics so I don't know where he stands on that stuff, but we talked a lot about punk rock and spirituality, which was very refreshing. In my mind he is one of the best new “screamers” I've heard since first encountering the music of Unearth back when they only had Above The Fall Of Man out. Carlos has that same sort of motivational, controlled yet torn and frayed sense of urgency in his vocals. I was also pleased to find him very positive and approachable, even on difficult questions of faith that some bands would prefer not to get into. If that's what you say your beliefs are then back them up! Before There Was Rosalyn not only make great music with a masterful control of tempo and tension, but they really ARE about creating dialogue. After all, as much as I like to rant about things I don't agree with, we're all people raised from different backgrounds and experiences who somehow have to co-exist. Carlos definitely renewed my faith that some of these newer Christian bands are into punk rock for the right reasons.

MORGAN Y. EVANS: What can you tell us about writing this record? It seems like it must have really been elaborate, as the songs are hard charging but not bland, and there is the wider arcing concept. What is the story behind all the character names for nearly every song?

CARLOS SALAZAR: The writing was definitely extensive. We began writing these songs almost as soon as our EP was done being tracked back in 2008. The concept for the record was developed before the songs came into play, so we knew going into them the kind of feel we wanted from each one of the songs. The titles of the tracks reflect upon the lyrics, for example “The Architect” reveals the track to be about God as Creator, while “The Deliverer” speaks about Him as Savior. Other tracks like “The Dustwalker” and “The Prophet” speak about two different aspects of Man, one as the creation, and another as the bringer of prophecy. Tracks like “The Deceiver” and “The Destroyer” are about the negative forces, those ancient serpents if you will, that have been at enmity with God since the beginning. They also represent the cold, desensitized shell of a being that we can become at our darkest. Brian Hood at 456 Recordings tracked the record in 3 weeks in Athens, Alabama. We tracked earlier demos with him, so having that familiarity with each other helped the process quite a lot.

MYE: "The Architect" has some real, slow punk riffs mixed in with the chuggy metal stuff. I find your band to have many recognizable elements of post-hardcore and metal, but it is really interesting how you are combining things and the use of big chords. I think it is pretty safe to say that you have somewhat of your own sound, which is hard these days. There's a lot of high octave riffs and big, cinematic plummeting parts as well. I love the weird ass guitar tones!

CS: Thank you. I think the outcome of songs like “The Architect” happened because while we all see eye to eye on what we want to do musically, we still have very different musical tastes and influences with things we grew up listening to that we love so much.

MYE: Can you discuss the album title? And I am sure you've been asked this, but were you nervous at all putting the word "Führer" in your record title, as some people might think you were fascists? Obviously you aren't. Victory Records put out Bad Brains Omega Sessions, not Screwdriver!

CS: Honestly, it was something we felt strongly about doing. We wanted to raise questions and provoke some thought, and hopefully that's what the title of the record does. Führer is a word that will always be associated with the atrocities of what happened in the mid 20th century, and things like that never lose relevance and never lose meaning .I'd venture to say it's very relevant to the social issues and causes of current affairs, and most definitely the same in the spiritual sense. Man is always at war with himself. The concept for the record is a journey out of chaos, destruction and despair, to finding hope and faith in a world where absolute power corrupts absolutely.

MYE: No argument there. How has your relationship been with Victory? They seem to be really giving you a great push with the new record!

CS: It's been a great relationship with the label. We are very excited to be a part of this particular family, and they have expressed their support and their belief in what we do, which is of great importance to us. We are very stoked to have this relationship grow as we go out on the road in support of the record as well.

MYE: Hopefully you'll take these questions in the open minded manner they are meant. I aim to promote debate and conversation on a few topics here. I hope you will take the time to consider them. I know your band comes from a very Christian background. I'm not exactly agnostic as
my grandfather was a minister and I am a very spiritual person. I believe in a Creator, but have a real hard time trusting the Bible, as I think mankind manipulates many things and so why wouldn't that writing have been tampered with at any given opportunity for the gain of different groups also? That said, I think Christ's lessons and especially many of the proverbs are amazing and benign and can promote real compassion between people, much as Buddhism can. I just don't go for parts of the Bible that seem to promote ethnic cleansing and homophobia and stuff like that. That seems to contradict love and understanding and seems like parts that show the taint of human closed-minded folly as possibly being behind the written words. That said, I have read elsewhere well-spoken things from your band about how there should be more unity among Christians even of differing beliefs.

CS: I think that God is definitely bigger and greater than the boxes we build for him inside our heads, and although Scripture can definitely be hard to understand, it does not promote hate, but love. There are definitely passages in Scripture that speak about things that may be uncomfortable to talk about, but in examining the contexts we can learn a very great deal about the kind of Truth that is meant for us to find within. One of the things that is sometimes overlooked when speaking about translations in The Bible is the notion that for these scribes that were translating the written word, the Scriptures embodied everything they believed in. They were as sacred to them as they are to any believer, and that's not to say that they were perfect people, but we can also think about the fact that when the Dead Sea Scrolls were discovered in the 20th century, the parchments retrieved from the caves contained copies of every book in the Old Testament with the exception of Esther, and they were a thousand years older than any other surviving translations at the time! And, when those discovered parchments were translated from their original languages, scholars found them to be identical to what you and I can find in any bookstore today, save for small variations like spelling. I'd say that's more evidence for the validity of the translations than you would need in a court of law. (read more here).

The New Testament of Scriptures has even more evidence for its accuracy and honesty, having some of its earliest writings circling about within the first 30 years after the events it portrays, which isn't a lot of time when compared to the accepted writings pertaining to the histories of Buddha or even Alexander The Great, which were written much later. Ultimately however, I believe in God, and because I do, I believe in what I have seen Him do to the hearts of men who give those hearts over to Him, and I believe that part of the reason why Jesus Himself never wrote anything down, but granted His Holy Spirit over to His disciples to keep account of all they had seen, is because part of the human struggle, is learning to trust one another. When you take that walk of faith, you have to trust that Mark, Matthew, Luke and John, (where I believe the "meat" of the Christian faith to be) are being honest with you, and I think when you read their accounts, you pick up on that sense of humanity, such as when Peter denies his best friend because he fears for his life, yet he has walked with Christ for three years. Peter was afraid and beaten. He was human. But Scriptures tell us that something happened on that third day that gave Peter more boldness than he had ever known, enough to take on the Roman Empire, and convert thousands. When Peter was arrested and put to death by crucifixion, he asked to be crucified upside down because he was not worthy to die like his Master. The same beaten and fearful man who denied he knew Christ, boldly stated he wasn't worthy to even die like Him. We all surely know of people who are willing to die for an idea, or a belief, perhaps a social cause, and surely our history and our current affairs are full of such things, but I have never met a man willing to die for something he knew to be a lie. Peter walked with Christ. Ate with Him. Laughed with Him. Slept beside Him. If anyone knew who and what this Man was, it was Peter, and Peter went to death for Him. So did all the others. The apostle John, who went on to write Revelations is the only one of the disciples (besides Judas who betrayed Him) that did not die a martyr's death. I think that speaks most to me about the truth of what happened in those Gospels. The humanity of those friends, who bore witness to a truth they knew was worth dying for, and so they did.

MYE: That's interesting. If you see something, seeing is believing, though people do die for things they THINK aren't lies in real life, like being told Iraq was responsible for 9/11. But you have interesting arguments.

CS: I'm aware that for some, that is simply not enough, and that's okay, too. C.S. Lewis once wrote about that "smoking gun" we would always be looking for but never find, because God said, "You will seek Me and find Me, when you seek Me with all of your heart." (Jeremiah 29:13) Ultimately, it will always be a leap of faith, and I think it has to be, because I think that's what God wants: our trust. Christ said it best, after granting Thomas permission to place his fingers within the wounds of His crucifixion, "You believe because you have seen, but blessed are those who believe, and have not yet seen." (John 20:29)

That being said, we most certainly believe in unity. If we are to truly open anyone's eyes to the truth of Jesus, we must be more like Him, when we share Him. Jesus met people's needs. He fed the hungry. He healed the sick. He raised the dead. He loved those who were outcasts, and he brought to them the Kingdom of God. Before anything else, He connected with people. He cared about them and their hearts, and forgave even those who were sometimes too afraid to forgive themselves, like the woman who stood before Him accused of adultery, after the crowd refused to throw the first stone. To her, He said, "Your accusers - where are they? Did no one condemn you?" "No one, Lord,"she replied. "Then, neither will I condemn you." (John 8:10-11). If we want to share that kind of love, we must be understanding to one another, and that is one thing we strive for, whatever your beliefs or your views may be, we want to offer you friendship and a place in our lives, that we may also have one in yours.

MYE: Your music has a sense of camaraderie. It really sounds like the band is almost a family. How did you all meet and get so close?

CS: We definitely strive to be a family, and consider ourselves one. Friendship and unity means everything when you commit yourself to so much time with one another, and our faiths and beliefs unite us even more in that sense. We all live in Houston, but ironically, so very spread out from each other. Jay and I have been doing this the longest together. That all really started for me on one cold night, whereafter seeing a band that spoke earnestly about a true relationship with Jesus Christ, I went home and prayed one of the most honest prayers I have ever offered to the Lord, letting Him know that I yearned for a band that was centered around Him and ministry. About three days later, I received a call, and I have been doing this ever since. Jay and I met the other guys from the local scene in Houston, one way or another, we were all brought together at different times, as members of the original line up moved on, the band came to be what it is today.

MYE: Ok, here's a long one. PLEASE answer this at length, I'd really appreciate it. I know some people really don't like it when bands get "preachy" on stage, whether it is political or religious. Sometimes at Murphy's Law’s shows, Jimmy, the singer, tells long, hysterical stories,
and some people love it but others just wanna hear music. Other bands like Rage Against The Machine talk or Boy Sets Fire have talked lots of cool political stuff on stage. I am a big fan of many Christian bands like Living Sacrifice and definitely Demon Hunter or The Chariot. Impending Doom have some monster riffs.

Still, I was guilty recently of being in a bad mood and hearing how For Today said people have been healed at their shows; it seemed absurd to me. It seemed like they were acting like no one had heard of Jesus yet and in an article I said they should shut up and relax/take it down a notch.
Then again, if your band or those guys are really passionate about something then really you have every right to talk about it as much as you want. I thought, "Hey, I should not be a hypocrite and reach out to one of these newer Christian bands" and try and have a discussion instead of throwing stones because of a momentary bad mood. Not every Christian band believes the same things anyway and punk rock should be about discussion as much as activism, spirituality or having a good time. But I am not just feeling guilty here. I really, genuinely like your music.
There is definitely a place for Christianity in punk rock, just like the Bad Brains are Rastafarian. I just personally have a problem with orthodoxy. I was raised in a Protestant background and as such don't think people need walls and strict rules to interract with spirituality, plus I believe in a woman's right to choose. Then again, as much as I love NOFX, I can see how some bands on Warped would be annoyed when Fat Mike drunkenly disrupted prayer meetings (even though it is funny, c'mon!)...but also you have to understand that he is reacting to the history of negative things the Church has done, like burning innocent women at the stake or hiding molestation to save face. Of course, that doesn't seem "punk" to him, it feels like the enemy. THAT feels like a history of deception. But like your band is known to profess, humanity has a capacity to create or destroy, and that goes for Christians also. And even some "satanist" bands or agnostics are really very open-minded people, like Malfeitor. Much of it is not about a red devil but rather about becoming more self-aware on a personal level. Listen to the Primordial song "Heathen Tribes" and it is amazing, lyrically. Of course, the metal bands that burned churches were wrong to do so. Thoughts? I'm not trying to patronize.I know you think of yourselves as a ministry first and band second, like the bio says, so was hoping you'd be receptive to talking.

CS: I definitely think that Jesus Christ was a "punk" by definition.

MYE: [laughing] "Jesus Was a Punk" is a song I just sang guest vocals on with the band Slimy Penis Breath at Josh Eppard's 30th birthday. It's funny you said that. I agree that his core teachings are very “punk”, in the more positive (not Sid Vicious nihilism) sense of the word!

CS: He was here to do away with the religious and even social structure that the hierarchies had put in place. Something that we are still trying to do today. He was here to say that you could have a personal relationship with Him without all the red tape that was being practiced at the time, and still is today. He was a spiritual revolutionary! I also think that whatever a man believes, that's who he is, which is why you have bands who will preach about whatever their personal beliefs and agendas are with such conviction. You can't separate the man from what he believes. And to those of us who are preaching Christ, we preach love, and unity, and that is something that I believe is essential no matter what your morals or faith might be. Unity is important, because if we cannot even agree to discuss our differing sets of values without hostility or ridicule, how can we ever truly expect to understand each other as human beings?

MYE: That's true, though I must admit it is hard not to feel and give in to verbal hostility at times. I am certainly guilty of that, but you are totally right.

CS: I don't claim to have all the answers, but we must open our hearts to each other. When our band says that we are a ministry first, that is exactly the kind of thing we mean. It doesn't just mean that we want to share our beliefs with you, but rather that we are more interested in meeting a need, emotional, or spiritual, physical if we can help, rather than whether you are buying a t shirt because you liked a breakdown. The church is always an interesting topic, but it can be best summarized as this, we are called to be the church, not go to church. There have been many negative things done by the church in the name of God, and if we ever want to honestly meet the needs of those hungry to be filled with God's truth, we must open our hearts to each other and to Him. We don't preach religion, we preach Christ, and we strive to make the distinction between the two.

MYE: That's important to me, too. Even Bill Maher in Religulous says it is better to be "Christlike" than hung up on being termed "Christian".

CS: Love is about connecting with one another, even when we do not share the same set of beliefs and values. I'd also like to add that I wholeheartedly believe that the Lord has a sense of humor, and there is a beautiful joy in laughter, even when (and I think perhaps especially) when we can laugh at ourselves.

MYE: That's for sure. I wish everyone had your attitude.

CS: I believe this new generation is bringing about a change in the social structure of the church that it so desperately needs to be able to reach out to the spiritually starving who desire and thirst for honesty and the Good News of the freedom in Christ, and not just someone looking to feel better about their week by attending a ritualistic service every Sunday. I do indeed feel there is more change, and more understanding between Christians and non-Christians in the post hardcore and metal scenes of today, than in a lot of churches on Sunday. These scenes have always been about expressing what you believe, and we want to be there, extending our hands to someone else who may feel the same way we do.

MYE: That's awesome. I will now officially wear your band's shirts now that I heard that. What's the scoop behind "The Belladonnamyth"? That is probably my favorite track musically, very hard charging. You guys have a lot of riffs that are just a march, and good use of controlled tempo. It's like this relentless assault.

CS: It was actually one of the first songs for the record, but it took a long time to develop it. It went through a few changes over the course of a few months, and ironically I think there was a time when it was almost left abandoned... but I was so attached to the lyrical content, and set on the music when it was originally written, that we brought the song back and worked on it until everyone's particular vision of what the track should sound like was met. It is definitely one of the most personal tracks on the record for me, so it always means a lot to hear it is being well received.

MYE: How did you tackle the challenge of building on what you'd started with the EP? Did you have big goals and do you feel you've met them? I mean, even the first video for "The Warrior" is seriously crazy!

CS: I'd like to believe that this is only the beginning. We want to take this ministry, this record, and our friendship to places we never dreamt we could. We plan on staying on the road as much as we possibly can, and meet everyone who takes time out of their day to come to a show. We are very excited about our first video and thankful for all the positive feedback we have received from it.

MYE: Let's talk about humility. As a musician/writer I sometimes feel really humble and thankful for the people that love my music from my past bands like Divest or Pontius Pilate Sales Pitch or who like what I write and whom I get to communicate with. I am sure it is the same for you guys. I feel like I could be happy with a small apartment and not that many materialistic needs as long as I had a bit of stability and could do my art. How do you feel about that? Is it the same for you? Secondly, do you think some people spend so much time asking God to save them that they don't try and work on their own problems? I know we aren't supposed to be "worldly" according to some beliefs, but doesn't too much leaning on God to fix everything mean
some people get tunnel vision and don't believe in their own strength?

CS: I think we as a band definitely share that view. We hope and aim for that kind of stability while still being able to stay gone away from home, bringing this message where we are led, and taking our music and our friendships to wherever we are welcome, and perhaps even some places where we are not welcome. Actor Michael Caine once wrote, "If you could see yourself doing anything other than acting, quit acting and do that." That's the way we feel about this calling and passion in our hearts and in our lives. Nothing else comes close to fulfilling that drive placed in our hearts.

MYE: Amen to that. Likewise.

CS: To address the second part of your question, I think one of the things that God is always trying to show us is our self-worth, and our inner strength. While I believe wholeheartedly in the power of prayer and God's desire to intervene for us and partake in this life with us, I believe that God invites us, and beckons to us to take the first step. God believes in your strength, and wants you to as well. We are capable of more than we might ever begin to realize, and God is fully aware of it, and encourages us to follow our dreams and our hearts, because He knows how to love best.

MYE: What are your favorite parts of touring and what are you most looking forward to about playing out the new songs?

CS: We love meeting new people and seeing new places. It is definitely a plus about being on the road, but we enjoy all of it. Being able to build relationships and partake in people's lives, however minuscule it may be for 30 minutes a night really means a lot, and we enjoy every moment we can. We really look forward to the feedback and hopefully the emotional connection we hope to acquire from new and old friends hearing these new songs.

MYE: Thank you very much, Carlos. I appreciate your thought provoking responses. Best of luck.

CS: Thank you so much for this, brother.